o/t FAO Simply Red and any nosey folk...

[Keith]

China isn't so much a clash of cultures, more a marinade.

Can't believe it is day thirteen already!
http://www.wendywutours.co.uk/china-tou ... ina-69.htm

Just arrived in Hangzhou, went for dinner in a restaurant at the stadium where Man Utd are playing next week (26th). Feels odd seeing Rooney, Ferdinand, Scholes, Giggs and Michael Owen smiling down from posters all around the city!

So what of China?

Beguiling, amazing, strange, odd, fascinating, scary, fantastic, friendly, amazing, weird, beautiful?
All of them, every day!

We've got used to being tourist attractions ourselves. At Chongqing Zoo they should have had an enclosure marked "Europeans" so the Chinese could take photos of us, I'm sure they showed us more interest than the pandas! The tour is frenetic, Wendy Wu Tours pack something in to every available minute! High points so far...

1. Terracotta Warriers,
2. Yangtze River, Three Gorges
3. Great Wall

but to be honest, everything has been special.

Anyone who doesn't realise that China will be THE world superpower in ten years time hasn't been paying attention!

What an amazing country!

[marky No.1]

Yeah we can see you

terracottaarmy.jpg

great wall.jpg

[Keith]

close!





But we were at a different, much steeper part of the wall

[Christies Child]

Best T Shirt ever.....problem is my wife decided that my Black one had faded too much and threw it out.

(Un)fortunately I wasn't wearing it at the time!

[Keith]

Total eclipse day tomorrow... I'll be wearing white again! Fingers crossed for a clear morning, 55% chance of cloud

[CASS]

China isn't so much a clash of cultures, more a marinade.

Can't believe it is day thirteen already!
http://www.wendywutours.co.uk/china-tou ... ina-69.htm

Just arrived in Hangzhou, went for dinner in a restaurant at the stadium where Man Utd are playing next week (26th). Feels odd seeing Rooney, Ferdinand, Scholes, Giggs and Michael Owen smiling down from posters all around the city!

So what of China?

Beguiling, amazing, strange, odd, fascinating, scary, fantastic, friendly, amazing, weird, beautiful?
All of them, every day!

We've got used to being tourist attractions ourselves. At Chongqing Zoo they should have had an enclosure marked "Europeans" so the Chinese could take photos of us, I'm sure they showed us more interest than the pandas! The tour is frenetic, Wendy Wu Tours pack something in to every available minute! High points so far...

1. Terracotta Warriers,
2. Yangtze River, Three Gorges
3. Great Wall

but to be honest, everything has been special.

Anyone who doesn't realise that China will be THE world superpower in ten years time hasn't been paying attention!

What an amazing country!

http://www.newstatesman.com/2009/06/wes ... hina-state

[shrimper]

Evidently it's the only man-made thing you can see from the moon.

























Keith's belly, that is.

[marky No.1]

Keith's belly, that is.

That reminds me, there should be a pre-match burger tonight

beer_barrel_belly_bruiser_burger.jpg

[Keith]

Evidently it's the only man-made thing you can see from the moon.


Keith's belly, that is.

OY!

That New Statesman article is really good.

Or else, they must admit that China can go on developing, and even overtake the west, while remaining as different from the west as it has ever been. This last is a terrifying scenario, as it implies that if a country westernises, that does not ensure its economic success – if anything, it may be an impediment. In other words, China may be so successful because it is so different from the west.

It occurred to me the other day, that as much as it sticks in my throat to say it, perhaps democracy isn't the way forwards?

China is currently buying up massive amounts of minerals etc from Australia in particular. They apparently have massive mineral wealth, including oil & coal reserves but they are using them slowly at the moment. Why? So that when everyone else's runs out in about 50 years time, they will still have huge reserves. No elected leader would plan 50 years ahead, they plan about as far as the next election. How many 'give away budgets' occur just in time for a General Election? In a one party state, leaders are more concerned with their legacy than with being re-elected, so long term planning is more important.

Only 'Party Members' can be in a position of power, but not everyone can become a Party Member. The 'brightest' students are entered for a test (or series of tests) and the successful ones become party members. One of our tour guides said that he had been entered for the test. He had to write a speech for a Party Leader who was visiting the victims of the earthquake to (hypothetically) deliver. He wasn't successful beyond that point ("but I was good enough to become a Wendy Woo tour guide!") Not having leaders elected is an anathema to me, but when I stopped to think about it, isn't this actually more of a meritocracy than the system we currently have, where you are more and more likely to come from a wealthy family if you want to be successful in politics?

What I do know is that when the world went in to melt down, the Chinese simply looked at promoting consumerism inside rather than outside. So far this year they have sold over 7,000,000 new cars in China. A forecasted 8% growth is apparently on target for this year.

I'd love to know Simply Red's view on things having experience of China away from the tourist route.

[Plain Peter]

Just returned from almost 3 weeks in Borneo.
Read the Borneo Post most days.
Life ain't all that great all over China.
Still got extensive regular flooding.
Regular earthquakes.
Ethnic unrest.
Even a 15 storey block of flats fell over, almost completely intact, due to cost saving.

See that you chose a tour Keith.
I think that for anything less than a month that's the best and safest option.
It looks expensive, but given what is included seems reasonable.
It's just the lack of flexibility of how long you can or cannot spend somewhere that might irk me.
Plus there's also the problem with what sort of travelling companions you might end up with.
Just imagine an unlikely mixture of bods off SV

[P/T Indie]

There is a thought Sv's world tours, who would get throw out of the plane first

[Plain Peter]

Chances are the one who might get off-loaded first might also be clever enough to have done a careful risk assessment beforehand, thus avoiding any potential misadventure.

[Keith]

There is a thought Sv's world tours, who would get throw out of the plane first

First off? Ned!

Agree with you Peter, tours can present their own problems. At the moment, our group is not doing too bad. We have one guy who is a bit of a pain in the arse (called Peter would you believe ) We've another nurse in the tour, I was chatting to her and said "I've wondered if he is early stage dementia?" She replied that she'd been thinking the same. He's in his 70's and travelling alone. How do you suggest to someone that they should see their GP when they get home without offending them? He was behind me coming through security for a flight the other day, he picked my boarding card up from my tray as I was putting my laptop back in the bag! Fortunately, as we searched around the x-ray machine, I remembered he'd been behind me so one of the others went to look for him. sure enough, both his & my boarding card were in his top pocket! Today we visited a temple and he went up to someone who was praying and started talking to them!

And yes, we have been 'busy', sometimes too much so. On the other hand, we've seen a lot! Swings & roundabouts. I could have spent a day in places where we had an hour or two but then, what would I have wanted to miss to make time for that day? Nothing! I'd love to come back one day.

[Plain Peter]

... he picked my boarding card up from my tray as I was putting my laptop back in the bag! Fortunately...

Sounds like you travelled light.
It amazes me how much gear do some people take on these organised safaris.
There are always those who insist on wearing something different and new every single day, and change again into something demanding attention every night.
There are the singlies, who often draw attention with their oddities.
Then there's those that keep everyone waiting, always late in the morning, always last back to the coach.
Those who moan about everything.
And then there are normal folk, who not long after take-off wonder what the hell they've let themselves in for for those 2 or 3 weeks.

On our last 3 week jaunt I wore a pair of light chinos, polo shirt, knicks, sox and walking sandals to travel in.
Apart from that I took 2 pairs of easy to dry light-weight shorts.
Three easy to dry Pompey footie shirts. (Crescent Moon and Star logo got lots of favourable comments in Malaysia). I gave one away to a very kind local without even wearing it.
Another pair of Karrimor walking sandals (best buy ever).
A small light back-pack for during the day.
Essential First Aid kit.
Digi camera and compact binoculars.
Plastic folder for all the documents/tickets.
That lot all went in a small pull-along, which I could have got away with not checking-in.
Doris travelled similar. She knew she'd be carrying what she took herself, so made sure she kept it to the absolute necessities.

It was hard work though, and what we packed in to that time completely knackered us out.
Cuba next time out I think, on a tour, with excess baggage.

[Christies Child]

Sounds my type of holiday Keith but try convincing my wife of that.

There are a few places I'd like to go to before finally leaving SVs.... Japan, Russia, Artic Circle, Iceland, Grand Canyon etc etc etc. Furthest I've been to is Mauritius but that was just pure luxury and chill for 14 days. This year it's Crete in September, meaning i'll miss Shrews and Bradford at home!

[Plain Peter]

This year it's Crete in September,

Beware of Greeks bearing gifts.

http://www.explorecrete.com/various/prices.htm

[Keith]

Cuba is easy to do on your own, even self drive is pretty straight forward & safe. Havana is a superb city to explore on your own.

As for Mrs Child, just keep nudging until you get away and hope she gets the bug for travel!

Packing? Yeah, we're not too bad, although my 'carry on' is often a little heavy because of the camera kit & laptop! I pack a photographers vest, so if need be, I can put it on and put the lenses etc in the pockets! We had to use our first aid kit today when one of our party managed to gash his leg quite well, always be prepared!

Back to China, and it was eclipse day today. The longest period of totality in any of our life-times. Unfortunately, clouds blocked the view for much of the time and all of totality, but it was amazing all the same.



We had our own Chinese astronomer to help us... A Chinese 'Patrick Moore'






















...well, kind of Patrick Moore!

[SimplyRed MFC]

Ni hao Keith, hao bu hao ?

Not been on SV for a few days so I'm just catching up on your travels. Sounds like you are having fun trying to unravel the conundrum that is 21st century China !

After 5 family visits to booming Guangzhou in Southern China, not necessarily to be confused with 5 holidays incidently, I am still trying to work out precisely where China is heading.

As you said, The New Statesman article is both fascinating and thought-provoking as is a recent book I read called "Beware The Dragon - A Thousand Years of Chinese History "

In January I asked Jun, my brother-in-law, what problems he saw ahead for his country. He replied that job-lessness ( there is no national social support - you don't work, you don't eat ) & ethnic unrest would be major problems in the next 5 years.

The outer regions of Tibet, Xinxiang Province & Inner Mongolia are potential flashpoints as numbers of the Han Chinese increase against it's traditional minorities ( China has 52 minorities ). 20,000,000 people lost their jobs in Guangdong Province alone in Dec/Jan this year.

The recent riots in Urumqi (Xinxiang Province ) were saddening & shocking. Urumqi is one of the first cities we always fly over on entry into China and I've always welcomed it's arrival on the planes location screen as a sign that another great exciting adventure is about to begin.

The sheer scale of China is colossal - if you put the extreme west of the country in Cork, Ireland, then the Eastern tip would be close to Afghanistan. If the Northern tip was in Aberdeen, then the Southerly point would be in Central Africa.

Flying west out of GZ for 6 hours and you are STILL in Chinese airspace, and with over 1.3 billion population it's problems are quite unique & vast

Jun also had an interesting opinion that the West has nothing to fear from the successful rise of China, but more of a worry if China failed in business terms as if the World's engine stalled then the whole global car could stop.

It has generally good relations with near neighbours including Japan, North & South Korea, Thailand, India & Vietnam. Although it is never wise to rule out an annual war of words with Japan and North Korea tends to get a bit over boisterous every couple of years and Beijing has to bring it's Communist neighbour to heel.

So where will it end up ? Your guess is as good as mine ! But it sure as hell will be fascinating,
and as you are discovering, it's people can be the most friendly, welcoming, nosey and hospitable hosts. Bizarrely, whilst being cool on Americans, they are very fond of the English !
( Very astonishing given the history of the last 150 years or so -cough- Hong Kong -cough- Opium Wars )

Have fun and I'll leave you with a useful phrase .....

" Ni hao, wo shu Yinguorhen Wo ai Yonguozhen, wo ai Tsingtao Pijiou - xie xie "
( excuse spelling !)

" Hello, I'm English, I love Chine and your local beer - thanks ! "

That should do the trick !

[Plain Peter]

The recent riots in Urumqi (Xinxiang Province ) were saddening & shocking. Beijing has to bring it's Communist neighbour to heel.

I read that the complete region had the internet closed down by the authorities, in an attempt to stop the unrest spreading. Hundreds killed and 'disappeared' apparently.

Tsingtao

Me and Doris had just developed a taste for Tsingtao, when all good things came to an end.

[SimplyRed MFC]

I shudder to imagine how hard China came down on the rioters in Urumqi - the rioting was reported to have started in response to an alleged incident involving one of the Uiger (sp?)minority groups thousands of miles away in Shenzhen, Guangdong province the previous week.

The Chinese authorities argue that if it lets the minorities try to claim any separation from China that a lot of provinces could follow in domino-style fashion as the old Soviet Union did in the late 80s

It would also say that it is protecting the interests of the Han Chinese in the area.

As for Tsingtao beer - it is brewed in the city of Tsingtao and the brewery there was built by the colonial Germans at the turn of the previous century - the Germans left soon after the Boxer Rebellion but the locals kept drinking their beer !

And a bloody good beer it is too !

[Posh]

Unfortunately, clouds blocked the view for much of the time and all of totality, but it was amazing all the same.

Yeeesssss. In 1999 I went to watch the eclipse in Luxembourg. The big idea was to look out for the weather forecast and then head for a place with little forecast cloud cover. Instead I was out in the city the night before and met a good crowd who invited us to a house for an 'eclipse party'. Turned up and we drank quite a bit, kept popping out to see partiality, but then when totality was due everyone was rather tipsy so for some stupid reason, and because it was cloudy, we caught cabs to go out of the city but never would have made it. We ended up sat in a supermarket car park with total cloud cover and then when totality came all the car park lights came on. Hey-ho.

[morecambe mick]

Tsingtao is horrible beer.

I have a customer who keeps giving me a bottle everytime I deliver to him.

I'll save you a bottle instead of trying to palm it off to others Steve.

[SimplyRed MFC]

Fine with me Mick, drop off as many as you like !

[morecambe mick]

Fine with me Mick, drop off as many as you like !

[Plain Peter]

Tsingtao is horrible beer.

I've got a label off a bottle for our holiday scrapbook.
It states +/-5% alkohol.
Does that mean it can vary, or might not travel too well?