Points deduction

[Billy bodger]

Jason made it clear that the Club had to live within it's means. He obviously did as the EFL asked and put the money in for an 'emergency'. Does seem strange that we had to dip into those funds so soon.
Must have given Jason a surprise too.

Having dipped into it in September, I'm surprised we've managed not to dip into it again over the winter months

I don’t read the EFL judgement like that at all. It was Jason’s responsibility to put monies into the ‘special account (125% of the wage bill). Not an emergency, but an agreed contingency of the 3 point deduction not being applied in March 2023. When monies were withdrawn to pay the wages, Jason had 5 days to replenish the account, because (as in his statement) he had cash flow problems due to not receiving monies due from other parties, was the reason he did replenish the account when he should have. I don’t believe it was for an ‘ emergency’, it was something that had to be done so we where not charged again by the EFL and the 3point deduction kick in because he and the Club defaulted on the agreement with them.

[black morse]

Jason made it clear that the Club had to live within it's means. He obviously did as the EFL asked and put the money in for an 'emergency'. Does seem strange that we had to dip into those funds so soon.
Must have given Jason a surprise too.

Having dipped into it in September, I'm surprised we've managed not to dip into it again over the winter months

I don’t read the EFL judgement like that at all. It was Jason’s responsibility to put monies into the ‘special account (125% of the wage bill). Not an emergency, but an agreed contingency of the 3 point deduction not being applied in March 2023. When monies were withdrawn to pay the wages, Jason had 5 days to replenish the account, because (as in his statement) he had cash flow problems due to not receiving monies due from other parties, was the reason he did replenish the account when he should have. I don’t believe it was for an ‘ emergency’, it was something that had to be done so we where not charged again by the EFL and the 3point deduction kick in because he and the Club defaulted on the agreement with them.

Yes Jason had to put the money into the fund to be used for emergency payment of wages but the question remains as to why there was a payment of wages emergency so early in the season after the bulk of the season ticket money had been received.

[vvm]

We can't see the full amounts as they've been redacted in the document but I bet Jason put the 125% and then told the club to use that immediately. Probably said I'm not sending any money for the wages this month, use what's in that account. Next month use what's left and I'll cover the rest.

[black morse]

We can't see the full amounts as they've been redacted in the document but I bet Jason put the 125% and then told the club to use that immediately. Probably said I'm not sending any money for the wages this month, use what's in that account. Next month use what's left and I'll cover the rest.

You may well be right but, if so, how the hell did he think he'd get away with that? It would be interesting to know the extent that Jason continues to pay the wages but that's something we'll never know.

Without a new owner by the summer I can't see how we'll survive. It's no wonder that there hasn't been an AGM for years.

[Gone_Shrimping]

Is administration a lesser evil to rid the club of Bond Group ?

[black morse]

Is administration a lesser evil to rid the club of Bond Group ?

Am I right in saying that only the owner can put the business in administration?

[Billy bodger]

We can't see the full amounts as they've been redacted in the document but I bet Jason put the 125% and then told the club to use that immediately. Probably said I'm not sending any money for the wages this month, use what's in that account. Next month use what's left and I'll cover the rest.

You may well be right but, if so, how the hell did he think he'd get away with that? It would be interesting to know the extent that Jason continues to pay the wages but that's something we'll never know.

Without a new owner by the summer I can't see how we'll survive. It's no wonder that there hasn't been an AGM for years.

At the forum the BOD’s told us one will take place this season, what they say and what they do and all of that, we wait!!

[Old Man Kensey]

Is administration a lesser evil to rid the club of Bond Group ?

That would probably result in us starting next season on -10 points. We could also see -2 points for annoying HMRC.

If we start on -12 points with a smaller budget and limited squad it really would be an uphill, almost impossible job, to keep our Football League status.

I do get the feeling that we are sleepwalking towards the edge of the cliff.

[Seasider9601]

All this drama reminds me of dear old Sir Ken Ormerod God Rest His Soul who literally had to empty the fruit machines in the bar to pay the players wages many, many years ago.

[Gone_Shrimping]

All this drama reminds me of dear old Sir Ken Ormerod God Rest His Soul who literally had to empty the fruit machines in the bar to pay the players wages many, many years ago.

I heard another one about Ken where after a particularly poor performance by the team he came into the dressing room after the game and threw the players pay packets on the table and said something like "who thinks they deserve one of those" !

[black morse]

All this drama reminds me of dear old Sir Ken Ormerod God Rest His Soul who literally had to empty the fruit machines in the bar to pay the players wages many, many years ago.

I heard another one about Ken where after a particularly poor performance by the team he came into the dressing room after the game and threw the players pay packets on the table and said something like "who thinks they deserve one of those" !

This is what I love about the British......at moments of acute crisis they relive all our yesterdays.

[Keith]

Got to say, not sneaking into the play-offs at the last moment is now a good thing. Could you image, getting into that last spot, then having a three-point deduction, and dropping back out?

Could we go into administration soon, and lose points from this season, not next?

[Gone_Shrimping]

All this drama reminds me of dear old Sir Ken Ormerod God Rest His Soul who literally had to empty the fruit machines in the bar to pay the players wages many, many years ago.

I heard another one about Ken where after a particularly poor performance by the team he came into the dressing room after the game and threw the players pay packets on the table and said something like "who thinks they deserve one of those" !

This is what I love about the British......at moments of acute crisis they relive all our yesterdays.

It's known as Gallows Humour

[shrimpsontoast]

Not entirely clear to me whether JW is not selling because he doesn’t want to (or he’s after an unreasonable amount) or because there isn’t a willing / viable buyer. On levering him out if it’s the former, can a football club do a successful pre-pack administration? Obviously it’s an automatic 10 point deduction if you go into administration, but the way a pre-pack works usually I think is that creditors of a company appoint an administrator to run it with the administrator then arranging for the company to sell the assets of the company to a third party, leaving a shell company behind. Presumably the EFL registration that is held by the club is not transferable to another company, at least without EFL approval. Does the EFL approved them? Most phoenix clubs have to start back down at the bottom of the pyramid don’t they?

[Ispyshrimp]

The Club has been sleep walking for a while. the fans were talked out of holding a decent protest to that of a support walk, poor and all seems to have been a complete waste of time.
The BOD are pacifying the fans, trying to keep things from boiling over.
The Wrexham game was a perfect opportunity to properly protest and have our name heard, making it on local news just doesn't do it, merely pointless IMO

The club needs to be sold ASAP, I'm not sure that Jason actually wants out and i get the feeling we are his only asset left after his Sh1t show at Worcester. I can't help feeling we've been mugged off and I for one will not be purchasing a season ticket yet, I would rather pay the additional fee once I feel comfortable in doing so.
Best thing to have happened this week is Ged and Rawson saying it as it is in the media, that's what us fans should have done at the Wrexham game and not let ourselves be convinced to turn it in to a bloody fun day!!!!
I feel for the players and Ged, regardless of the performances which could have led us to the play offs, having this much doubt over their heads cant be easy.
This is our club and we are letting this clown put us at risk

[Born again Bill]

The main question for me is if this shit show takes a turn for the worse and we slip in to administration because of the T#AT OF AN OWNER , what happens to the hard earned money we have shelled out for season tickets ? . Might sound a bit dramatic but it could happen !!!!

[Billy bodger]

All the talk about administration is just speculative, maybe right, maybe wrong. A lot of that will be decided on early bird season tickets, hopefully we don’t lose to many supporters that hold one. The other factors are what we get off the FA, sponsorship, corporate income (what ever that amounts to) and the monies we get off the premiership. We are not financially well off, but we knew that from what JW said and did in investing in the Club.

To add to the speculation I think it will be a tall order next season as it is because of what we can do as a Club in our situation. Therefore the last thing we want, is to start the season on minus ten points.

Everything must be done to keep us in the league, cannot JW sell the majority of his shares so an investor ends up with 51% of the shares and control of the Club and then has money left to invest in the Club especially the players.

[Freez]

A buyer approaches a board member, asks “How much do you want?”
Board member replies “I don’t know, ask Jason. He owns us”.
Buyer approaches Jason “How much do you want?”
Jason, writing daft price on back of fag packet, shows it to buyer….
“Right thanks, but we will pass”.

This is the issue. This is what in reality is happening.
There have been numerous enquiries, all of them having walked away after talking to Bond Group and Bond Group alone.

If Jason won’t even agree to tell the board what he is asking, as the owner, what are the board supposed to do.
What needs to happen is for the board to be let in on the secret and be actively involved in the sale. The sooner Bond Group realise this the better for all.
As it stands, we are at a stalemate where we lurch from one idiotic crisis to the next, culminating in this three point farrago and yet more bad press.

The businessmen of the board are better placed to broker a workable deal with a prospective buyer than the chancer and his struck off mate (who is still lurking in the background I understand) who with even some cursory background checks can be seen for what they are!

Moaning about watered down protests and other stuff is all peripheral to the above issue, that’s the nub. Simple as.

Sooner or later it needs to dawn on Jason that he stands a better chance of selling with help.

[black morse]

A buyer approaches a board member, asks “How much do you want?”
Board member replies “I don’t know, ask Jason. He owns us”.
Buyer approaches Jason “How much do you want?”
Jason, writing daft price on back of fag packet, shows it to buyer….
“Right thanks, but we will pass”.

This is the issue. This is what in reality is happening.
There have been numerous enquiries, all of them having walked away after talking to Bond Group and Bond Group alone.

If Jason won’t even agree to tell the board what he is asking, as the owner, what are the board supposed to do.
What needs to happen is for the board to be let in on the secret and be actively involved in the sale. The sooner Bond Group realise this the better for all.
As it stands, we are at a stalemate where we lurch from one idiotic crisis to the next, culminating in this three point farrago and yet more bad press.

The businessmen of the board are better placed to broker a workable deal with a prospective buyer than the chancer and his struck off mate (who is still lurking in the background I understand) who with even some cursory background checks can be seen for what they are!

Moaning about watered down protests and other stuff is all peripheral to the above issue, that’s the nub. Simple as.

Sooner or later it needs to dawn on Jason that he stands a better chance of selling with help.

So basically, despite the board giving the open statement to Jason in early December, little has changed and we seem no nearer the ultimate goal. Jason may have been waiting to see whether we got promoted again, which might have brought our realistic worth nearer to his figure, but now that isn't going to happen. Will that and the various sanctions we are now getting hit with force him to reduce his figure and work with the board to get it sorted?

[Billy bodger]

A buyer approaches a board member, asks “How much do you want?”
Board member replies “I don’t know, ask Jason. He owns us”.
Buyer approaches Jason “How much do you want?”
Jason, writing daft price on back of fag packet, shows it to buyer….
“Right thanks, but we will pass”.

This is the issue. This is what in reality is happening.
There have been numerous enquiries, all of them having walked away after talking to Bond Group and Bond Group alone.

If Jason won’t even agree to tell the board what he is asking, as the owner, what are the board supposed to do.
What needs to happen is for the board to be let in on the secret and be actively involved in the sale. The sooner Bond Group realise this the better for all.
As it stands, we are at a stalemate where we lurch from one idiotic crisis to the next, culminating in this three point farrago and yet more bad press.

The businessmen of the board are better placed to broker a workable deal with a prospective buyer than the chancer and his struck off mate (who is still lurking in the background I understand) who with even some cursory background checks can be seen for what they are!

Moaning about watered down protests and other stuff is all peripheral to the above issue, that’s the nub. Simple as.

Sooner or later it needs to dawn on Jason that he stands a better chance of selling with help.

I think all fans know the situation between the Band Group and perspective buyers, it’s a wonder that doesn’t put off any more people looking into buying us. So it does beg the question, does he really deep down want to sell?

One question rises from what Freez calls cursory background checks and that it shows, ‘what they are’, yet they must not have done anything wrong so the EFL can step in. So are the EFL rules not strong enough, when it comes to ownership?
Unless someone out there does know something and has of yet they have not come forward!

[black morse]

A buyer approaches a board member, asks “How much do you want?”
Board member replies “I don’t know, ask Jason. He owns us”.
Buyer approaches Jason “How much do you want?”
Jason, writing daft price on back of fag packet, shows it to buyer….
“Right thanks, but we will pass”.

This is the issue. This is what in reality is happening.
There have been numerous enquiries, all of them having walked away after talking to Bond Group and Bond Group alone.

If Jason won’t even agree to tell the board what he is asking, as the owner, what are the board supposed to do.
What needs to happen is for the board to be let in on the secret and be actively involved in the sale. The sooner Bond Group realise this the better for all.
As it stands, we are at a stalemate where we lurch from one idiotic crisis to the next, culminating in this three point farrago and yet more bad press.

The businessmen of the board are better placed to broker a workable deal with a prospective buyer than the chancer and his struck off mate (who is still lurking in the background I understand) who with even some cursory background checks can be seen for what they are!

Moaning about watered down protests and other stuff is all peripheral to the above issue, that’s the nub. Simple as.

Sooner or later it needs to dawn on Jason that he stands a better chance of selling with help.

I think all fans know the situation between the Band Group and perspective buyers, it’s a wonder that doesn’t put off any more people looking into buying us. So it does beg the question, does he really deep down want to sell?

One question rises from what Freez calls cursory background checks and that it shows, ‘what they are’, yet they must not have done anything wrong so the EFL can step in. So are the EFL rules not strong enough, when it comes to ownership?
Unless someone out there does know something and has of yet they have not come forward!

Shouldn't that read "unless someone out there knows a hitman"

[marky No.1]

All this drama reminds me of dear old Sir Ken Ormerod God Rest His Soul who literally had to empty the fruit machines in the bar to pay the players wages many, many years ago.

Lowest budget or not, it would have to be an enormous fruit machine nowadays, a casino in Las Vegas might help

[Keith]

The fans were talked out of holding a decent protest to that of a support walk, poor and all seems to have been a complete waste of time.

The Wrexham game was a perfect opportunity to properly protest and have our name heard, making it on local news just doesn't do it, merely pointless IMO

Best thing to have happened this week is Ged and Rawson saying it as it is in the media, that's what us fans should have done at the Wrexham game and not let ourselves be convinced to turn it in to a bloody fun day!!!!

What would you suggest should have been done instead, and what outcome would it have achieved? What do you think will actually be achieved by Rawson speaking out?

The Club has been sleep walking for a while.

The BOD are pacifying the fans, trying to keep things from boiling over.

The club needs to be sold ASAP, I'm not sure that Jason actually wants out and i get the feeling we are his only asset left after his Sh1t show at Worcester.

This is our club and we are letting this clown put us at risk

On this, I agree, 100%. But with an owner who appears to be completely out of touch with reality, we're screwed, as he can't be forced to sell. I am slowly coming to the conclusion that going into administration is the only way forward for the club. It may be that HMRC may force his hand. Or, if they are actually enforceable, the EFL taking him to court for the fines that they have imposed, which depending on his available cash, may force him under.

If he's asking for £10,000,000 he'll never sell the club.
If he's asking for £1 (as Ken Bates bought Chelsea for) then he'd sell it today.

The difficulty is finding an amount that he's willing to accept, that someone else is willing to pay. I wonder if, ultimately, heading for administration, where he'd get nothing, and potentially still end up with debt, and no asset, force him to accept something that simply covers his debts?

[Old Man Kensey]

Would stopping the game next week force John's hand?
If the game cannot finish would that aid the administration process.

Desperate times and all that?

[Keith]

Would stopping the game next week force John's hand?
If the game cannot finish would that aid the administration process.

Desperate times and all that?

Or, we'd start next season with a points deduction as punishment? Whittingham doesn't give a toss about the club, so it makes no difference to him.