Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Mike W. » Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:27 pm

There has been comment, some less than complimentary but some also appreciative of efforts by those involved in running the existing Supporters Club. Gratitude is expressed for that appreciation, and I am sorry that these comments may be seen as a bit late in the day. I did discuss this with Keith Fitton before information was anything but vague, but views were expressed by others in and around Morecambe Football Club that our comments should be kept back until the long term situation about any new supporters group was better known.

However, it seems that a summary of the past and current situation of Shrimps Supporters could be useful, if only to offset some of the misconceptions and downright inaccuracies that have been put around recently. I apologise that this piece may be a bit long, but several aspects are relevant and need to be given air. I do ask that what I say here is taken as a whole and that bits are NOT taken out of context.

The Supporters Club was formed quite a long time ago now, after a series of good cup runs, especially, signalled the return of the Football Club to its position as one of the best non-league clubs in the North, after a long period of struggle and obscurity, relieved only by the 1974 trip to old Wembley in our FA Trophy triumph.

Things started well and after a few years the then committee approached the Football Club, and it was agreed that the Supporters club would become the “Official Morecambe Football Supporters Club” - the OMFSC.

OMFSC organised supporters’ away transport and increasingly successful functions including New Year’s Eve parties and race nights, raising notable funds for the Football Club as well as OMFSC itself.

Sadly, after some years, a dispute arose concerning the management, by the Football Club, of the bar at Christie Park. A number of fans decided to take their business elsewhere, and boycott the bar, and as a result, attendances there were never as good, except on match days, as many fans stayed away, simply getting out of the habit of going into the club during the week. Those supporters left using the club (some still there from a real sense of loyalty to the Football Club) struggled to attract even poor attendances to their events, which became increasingly unviable financially and a serious drain on OMFSC resources.

This situation became even worse when the Football Club started asking, either that OMFSC should guarantee takings over the bar at a function, or simply pay a fee for the bar’s hire, or even both. The Football Club also now took the view, even expressed at shareholders’ meetings, that the bar could only really be a match-day facility. Particularly in view of the poor attendances, OMFSC simply could not afford to operate on this basis, and functions essentially ended. Alternative venues were investigated but their owners would always seek often considerable fees making the situation again unviable.

Running supporters’ away transport does continue, often with good numbers carried to popular games. It has to be said that ideas that all supporter transport should be “amalgamated”, with all fans travelling together, are unrealistic. Not all supporters want the same thing from their transport. Some clearly want boisterous “bouncing” buses, often with pub stops, going to and from the match. That kind of trip HAS to be managed very carefully, of course. It is illegal for alcohol to be carried on coaches to designated matches – all games down to and including Conference level nowadays are “designated” – and it is also illegal to try to enter a designated match ground if showing signs of drink. Coach firms and organisers can be held responsible and fined heavily.

On the other hand, many fans wish to travel to away games, setting off as late as is practical, heading for home immediately after the match, and having only limited necessary stops each way, usually at motorway service stations. If they want a drink, they prefer to get it by heading for a pub in Morecambe when we get home. This group includes many older fans that have supported Morecambe FC for a very long time. Additionally, there are families who, rightly, consider it inappropriate for their kids to spend much time in pubs, or alongside those who may have “had a few”.

These supporters are just as entitled to have their travel needs catered for as others, and it is largely these groups that Shrimps Supporters provides for. These fans would be very unlikely to accept any change to the way we do things.

Note that there are important considerations when the carriage of children and other vulnerable persons is contemplated.

“OMFSC” became “Shrimps Supporters” a few years later when it was felt that “Official” implied too close a connection with the Football Club. That connection did not actually exist, with the Football Club’s ONLY support for us once being, as stated above, to allow free use of Club facilities. OMFSC and Shrimps Supporters has NEVER been supported financially by the football Club, as we have always taken the view that as supporters we should help the Football Club, when we can, and not the other way round. This also stopped us making public occasional disagreements we may have had with the Football Club, as we did not want to “wash our dirty linen in public”, possibly harming the interests of the Football Club. It is hoped that the Football Club appreciates that, and the trouble it has sometimes caused us.

An example here is the sad demise of our Junior Reds wing. Alison Fleetwood would be able to explain her problems in more detail here, but suffice it to say that, since the ground move, she has tried to arrange use of Football Club facilities for the Junior Reds without success. Lacking progress and with the season now well advanced the decision had to be taken recently to wind up the group. Any attempt to resurrect the Junior Reds would be complex, especially taking into account modern child protection regulations.

It is true that Shrimps Supporters is now running at a low key level. In great part, this is due to the fact that there are now only a handful of us running things. So few can only do so much. Over the years we have tried many times to encourage members and other fans to join us in the work, but volunteers have always been notably conspicuous by their absence, with fans, apparently, content to allow others to run things for them. The few that we have managed to recruit have often, sadly, wanted just to sit on the Committee and “spout off”, not actually doing any real work. That is clearly of no use to us.

The new supporters group, hopefully, demonstrates a welcome increase in the willingness of Morecambe supporters to actually get their hands dirty and get involved. It remains to be seen whether the welcome enthusiasm is maintained when the amount of work and commitment necessary long term is appreciated. The number of ACTIVE workers may prove to be more limited than expected in time.

The new group, the name of whose organisers I do not fully know, does appear to have taken the decision very early on that a NEW supporters club of some variety was needed, certainly before many of us even knew the group existed as such. It is disappointing that they did not approach Shrimps Supporters, which some certainly knew still existed, to ask, firstly, why our activities have been so low key, and secondly, to discuss what could be done to enhance those activities. Shrimps Supporters would have been more than willing to talk over how help could best be given, so long as new helpers were actually willing to work.

Sadly, Shrimps Supporters has not been given that chance ! We would though be willing to talk things over and Shrimps Supporters does have some quite limited resources that could be available to take forward agreed plans.

Mike Williamson
Deputy Chair Shrimps Supporters

:!:
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Seasider9601 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:36 pm

To be fair Mike, I did post a few times in the original discussions that yourself and/or Ian Lyon should have some input as to the proposed new group etc. if only for guidance and assistance and advice etc.

Obviously you didn't see these posts, or I would have hoped you might have put something down in reply.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby ockers » Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:42 pm

Seasider9601 wrote:To be fair Mike, I did post a few times in the original discussions that yourself and/or Ian Lyon should have some input as to the proposed new group etc. if only for guidance and assistance and advice etc.

Obviously you didn't see these posts, or I would have hoped you might have put something down in reply.


To be fair Martin, I would imagine Mike has, but decided and quite righly to set out the facts in his post, which imho is very well put, and states some very valid observations
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby thegentlegiant » Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:43 pm

The new group, the name of whose organisers I do not fully know, does appear to have taken the decision very early on that a NEW supporters club of some variety was needed, certainly before many of us even knew the group existed as such. It is disappointing that they did not approach Shrimps Supporters, which some certainly knew still existed, to ask, firstly, why our activities have been so low key, and secondly, to discuss what could be done to enhance those activities. Shrimps Supporters would have been more than willing to talk over how help could best be given, so long as new helpers were actually willing to work.


Not having a dig at this comment or anything of the sort, we have openly discussed the ideas via the forum and people have asked if the supporters club is still running with no response, its very annoying from a fans point of view when it seems there has been lack of communication, I am personally sorry even though I am not the one that has started the idea I fully support the plans and hope to become a part of the team.

On a whole I think we need to reignite the shrimps supporters club and start again, but those who are still running the current one I would love to see join us and use your wisdom and ideas and hopefully give those who already actively play a part, to continue to play there part.

I think its an ideal time to restart this due to our move to the new ground, they have lots of facilities that can be utilised by the supporters club and the great thing is the hospitality team will be in attendance on Tuesday to help and discuss our ideas.

I would like to thank you Mike for coming on the forum and expressing your feelings and I certainly hope to see you on Tuesday, I hope most people agree with my comments and we can move forward with the idea.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Gnasher » Fri Jan 14, 2011 3:45 pm

Seasider9601 wrote:To be fair Mike, I did post a few times in the original discussions that yourself and/or Ian Lyon should have some input as to the proposed new group etc. if only for guidance and assistance and advice etc.

Obviously you didn't see these posts, or I would have hoped you might have put something down in reply.

Mike and Ian aren't hard to miss at most games if anyone wanted to talk to them, in fact I'd say along with Keith that they are the most noticeable supporters on the pitch :lol:

thegentlegiant wrote:Not having a dig at this comment or anything of the sort, we have openly discussed the ideas via the forum and people have asked if the supporters club is still running with no response, its very annoying from a fans point of view when it seems there has been lack of communication, I am personally sorry even though I am not the one that has started the idea I fully support the plans and hope to become a part of the team.


Ahh yes, the world revolves around the internet attitude. You'd be surprised how many regular supporters don't read this forum.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Mike W. » Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:01 pm

I do TRY not to be so noticable - remembering the time when I got onto the TV early last season doing a little dance as the fireworks (what a waste of money) went off as the teams came out. I was just faking it, as they say, because the firworks were so pathetic, but the TV seemed to think I was actually frightened !

Anyway, I have not posted a comment before now because, as I say in my piece, others in t' club suggested we should await developments, but those developments seemed to have come about rather more quickly than expected. Hence my comments.

Another point is that not everyone has time to stay logged in all the time - some of us have commitments and only get to look in occasionally. You might appreciate that as Football Supporters Federation National Secretary, AND Lancashire League Registration Secretary, plus having my pics to process, and distribute, I am fairly well occupied !

To answer a comment, it IS the intention of Ian and I to attend the meeting at t' Globe - sitting at the back being quiet and attentive, ready to comment only when someone says something we KNOW is awry. We ARE likely to be willing to continue working as we do.

AS I say in the piece, I would HOPE that the article will be taken as a whole, and bits and pieces not takebn out of context.

I have to comment that the Club's readiness to allow use of the Globe is welcome for the meeting. As I say in my piece, one of the reasons for our low-key approach is that we lost free use of Club facilities.

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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Morecambe Jack » Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:13 pm

People need to realise that the football club does not revolve around Shrimpsvoices! Everyone cannot be expected to have read things written on here.

That aside, the most disappointing thing for me is that the club have let Junior Reds end through not supporting the group and Alison Fleetwood. It is absolutely ludicrous that they can't find room in the new stadium when they only met once a month (and we have a bar that is empty 25 days of the month). I was a member of Junior Reds and it allowed me to be mascott of the Marsden Trophy Final against Accrington and thats something I will never forget. Will the club please wake up and stop focusing on the bloody corporate money and start thinking of the fans - I'm not one to criticise the club I support, but it is seriously winding me up now.

I can't attend the meeting on tuesday as I'm in the middle of exams but I hope that the new group can work with Ian and Mike for the good of fans as a whole - we need supporters to come together not have multiple seperate groups (although for the purposes of transport, I fully agree that seperate travel arrangements makes sense).
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby P/T Indie » Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:21 pm

An example here is the sad demise of our Junior Reds wing. Alison Fleetwood would be able to explain her problems in more detail here, but suffice it to say that, since the ground move, she has tried to arrange use of Football Club facilities for the Junior Reds without success. Lacking progress and with the season now well advanced the decision had to be taken recently to wind up the group. Any attempt to resurrect the Junior Reds would be complex, especially taking into account modern child protection regulations.

Good to hear Mike's reponse and a fair and balanced post.

Now for me many things have annoyed me about the clubs attitutde since the move but this is the biggest thing for me. To say there are no facilties for them is unbelivable wasn't that the whole point of the move to have better facilities for us all?

I am sure there is more to this story but from the outside it looks like the club has lost intrest in the whole friendly, family club ethos that we used to have and just want the prawn sandwich brigade.
Sadly because the Junior Reds want be providing income to the club they are not intrested anymore.

The club are after getting new people in the club not football people. They are more intrested in companys to use the conference facilties through the weeks, weddings etc we are now a conference facility with a football team attached not the other way around.

and sadly they are not doing a great job in that in the past couple of months we have tried to book a xmas party night and have requested a wedding brochure/price list and neither have been forthcoming.


Sorry about the rant!
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Mike W. » Fri Jan 14, 2011 4:45 pm

:roll:

Just to say that I used to bore people silly, probably, when I said regularly that IF we EVER got into the League, things would change a LOT round here. Contact with players would be more limited, there would be less use of volunteer workers (less reliable and harder to sack, when they make a bal.. sorry a hash of it ! ) and chiefly there was bound to be a concentration on fund raising work.

The fact is that being in the League is fuc... sorry ... flipping expensive, and club's have to concentrate on where they can rake most dosh in to pay for it i.e from the business world. Sadly, "ordinary" fans can never provide anywhere near as much money and few clubs cover their costs from match day admission monies. That is even the case with those clubs that are supporter owned.

That is NOT to say that supporters cannot be totally appreciated and their views and interests fully taken account of. Football clubs are not just ordinary limited companies - they are community assets, and have to act that way.

That last bit is one of my rants, sorry, and I do not get much chance to rant - they chuck out photographers that shout a lot !

:evil:

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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby ezz » Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:10 pm

i dont see why a supporters club shouldn't be able to incorporate both sets of fans i.e by those family orientated and those wanting to have a good time, drink and sing loudly.
I'd like to see both merged and obviously functions can involve both sets of fans, whilst travel can be split with Mike continuing to do such a good job with those family groups and the new group having people arrnaging it for those wanting a different experience.

Easier said than done im sure
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby marky No.1 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:23 pm

ezz wrote: travel can be split with Mike continuing to do such a good job with those family groups and the new group having people arrnaging it for those wanting a different experience.

Easier said than done im sure


Yes it will be difficult to make things black and white, I suspect a few shades of grey will remain :lol:
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Keith » Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:42 pm

I welcome Mike's post and would hope that rather than sit at the back, he is sitting right at the front! This meeting I believe is an opportunity for everyone to work together, finding common ground. It really doesn't matter what the name is or the history, it's the going forwards that matters. And if Mike's experience means that moving forward doesn't involve reinventing the wheel, then that is great.

As for travel, I said in the first 'new supporters club' thread that I believe trying to amalgamate different travel groups would be a mistake. What I would like to see is better communication regarding travel, spare seats etc. There is some communication via this forum but I think that it could be better. For example, how about a 'supporters club' page in the programme or in the e-news letter that the club send out? Travel contact details could be then circulated to a wider audience.

I won't be there and obviously, due to my location, I wouldn't be putting myself forwards even if I could be there, but I sincerely hope the meeting is successful. Working together, in the same direction, I'm sure it will be.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Freez » Fri Jan 14, 2011 5:59 pm

Im sure those in charge have checked, but the Reds, Globe Bar n Grill, JB's, Stabbies or whatever its called this week hasnt opened any night since before Xmas? Just thought it should be considered?
Good luck with this, I hope it is well attended.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby marky No.1 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:06 pm

Freez wrote:Im sure those in charge have checked, but the Reds, Globe Bar n Grill, JB's, Stabbies or whatever its called this week hasnt opened any night since before Xmas? Just thought it should be considered?
Good luck with this, I hope it is well attended.


Check Tobys post on the other thread, Freez. They are opening the bar and arranging food :D
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Sammy h » Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:34 pm

Can we not just add members to the one already set up and go from there?

I don't understand why you have waited until now to rant about it, if you would have simply let us know we could have solved it. Sounds to me like your throwing your toys out of the pram because another club is being formed.

I am sure we can sort something out.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby bigreddog » Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:37 pm

Many thanks for all the information Mike, and I like Keith really welcome everything you've mentioned. I've just got back from a long meeting with a club official talking about the very things you've mentioned. I think it's important to recognise all the hard work and dedication that you, Alison and many others have brought and continue to bring to the morecambe supporters family. I think, as you've mentioned, it's also important for those that are now volunteering to help to recognise what hard work this all is. A talking shop, this cannot be.

I have absolutely no personal preference on how we move forward, and reinventing the wheel is definately something we should avoid, a launch, a relaunch or whatever way we all agree to move forward, I don't think anything else matters from that point of view.

I'm sure it must be one of those situations, and I've certainly been there before, when you slogg your guts out for something, with little help, then somebody else comes along and sounds like they've just discovered electricity. I'm sorry that I didn't live in the area when you needed help, or I would have volunteered then. but I suppose we are where we are. further to that you mentioned that this has all happened quickly, and I absolutely agree, and I'm as surprised s anyone. And,by the way, I still have no idea who's original idea to look at this issue was, like many others I just turned up to the meeting.

As you mentioned the travel issue, I'll just address that very briefly too if that's okay. At the moment all I wanted to do is relay information from the exploratory meeting that happened after the Accy game. It's not my place to discount ideas one way or the other, but my personal view ( and it's only my personal view) is that you are right in every aspect about the amalgamation idea. I don't think it would be either practical or appropriate. what maybe the group could do, as keith mentioned, is to help with the communication process to help those people like yourself and others who put so much effort into arranging transport, to get more bums on seats.

All we want to do is help, not detract from peoples hard work or their previous efforts.

lastly I think the internet centric comments are absolutely right, the world doesn't revolve around websites, and that's precisely why we're leafletting at the club tomorrow to find out interest levels. for all we know, this is beer fueled enthusiasm and nobody else is interested, but we'll soon know.

I hope that clarifies things, and i want to pay tribute to Mike, Alison and all those other fans who have worked so hard on behalf of our club and our community.

p.s. I hope you don't mind Mike but the club official gave me your number to get in touch so I'll give you a ring if that's alright.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby marky No.1 » Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:47 pm

Sammy h wrote:Can we not just add members to the one already set up and go from there?

I don't understand why you have waited until now to rant about it, if you would have simply let us know we could have solved it. Sounds to me like your throwing your toys out of the pram because another club is being formed. .


That type of comment doesn't help, Sammy!
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby ockers » Fri Jan 14, 2011 6:55 pm

Sammy h wrote:Can we not just add members to the one already set up and go from there?

I don't understand why you have waited until now to rant about it, if you would have simply let us know we could have solved it. Sounds to me like your throwing your toys out of the pram because another club is being formed.

I am sure we can sort something out.


im not sure how old you are but you seriously need to grow up
and dont be so disrespectful either
i look forward to seeing you on tuesday night...............
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby ockers » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:06 pm

All we want to do is help, not detract from peoples hard work or their previous efforts.

darren
check youre emails ive sent one or two bits over to you
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby The Voice » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:42 pm

Interesting developments over the last few weeks! I have been away the last couple of weeks with little chance of access to here and was embarrassed not to make the Accrington game but I must say I am delighted that Bigreddog and Co have moved things on. It looks like there is a lot of enthusiasm out there.

I must say I got the impression from a previous post that Mike W and Co. were aware of the interest and that the Shrimps Supporters was now 'little more than a travel club'. It does seem a coincidence that now there is a large amount of interest that there is a cry of foul play! ;)

Some honest questions for Mike with all the due respect you deserve for the past sterling work you have done.

What activity has there been to attract members to the Shrimps Supporters and what activities have there been over the last two seasons?

How many minuted meetings have there been in the last two seasons?

Why do you think that a independant group of fans have decided they need to form a group?

If you havent got time to read the only message board that that Morecambe fans use due to your other commitments, how much time would you have to give to a fully functional Supporters club or are you suggesting that you think it is time to hand the reins over to a group of fans with the time and energy?

My personal opinion (FWIW) is that the new group of people should take over that old Fan Club and that they should invite Mike & Co to act as advisors and maybe run the travel section as they currently do so succesfully as well as liaising with the FSC.

I am sure a compromise can be sought but one thing is for sure, to all intents and purpose there is no active fans club at the moment and unless this new energy is harnessed and embraced there will not be one going forward.

Grab the opportunity for the greater good. It would be a crying shame if we are in the same position in six months as we have been in the last two years.

Good luck everyone. I will try my best to be there on Tuesday and lend my support, but I think my job as a 'Voice' is done.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby halftimeresults » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:48 pm

Mike W. wrote:
The new group, the name of whose organisers I do not fully know, does appear to have taken the decision very early on that a NEW supporters club of some variety was needed, certainly before many of us even knew the group existed as such. It is disappointing that they did not approach Shrimps Supporters, which some certainly knew still existed, to ask, firstly, why our activities have been so low key, and secondly, to discuss what could be done to enhance those activities. Shrimps Supporters would have been more than willing to talk over how help could best be given, so long as new helpers were actually willing to work.

Sadly, Shrimps Supporters has not been given that chance ! We would though be willing to talk things over and Shrimps Supporters does have some quite limited resources that could be available to take forward agreed plans.

Mike Williamson
Deputy Chair Shrimps Supporters

:!:

The new group has not been form yet , so how can they approach the Shrimps supporters?
That is why we are having the meeting this week. Everybody that attends the game on saturday will get a leaflet meaning that everybody can come and have their say.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby thegentlegiant » Fri Jan 14, 2011 7:53 pm

Gnasher wrote:
Seasider9601 wrote:To be fair Mike, I did post a few times in the original discussions that yourself and/or Ian Lyon should have some input as to the proposed new group etc. if only for guidance and assistance and advice etc.

Obviously you didn't see these posts, or I would have hoped you might have put something down in reply.

Mike and Ian aren't hard to miss at most games if anyone wanted to talk to them, in fact I'd say along with Keith that they are the most noticeable supporters on the pitch :lol:

thegentlegiant wrote:Not having a dig at this comment or anything of the sort, we have openly discussed the ideas via the forum and people have asked if the supporters club is still running with no response, its very annoying from a fans point of view when it seems there has been lack of communication, I am personally sorry even though I am not the one that has started the idea I fully support the plans and hope to become a part of the team.


Ahh yes, the world revolves around the internet attitude. You'd be surprised how many regular supporters don't read this forum.


Your probable right about that brian, Most of my work involve use of the net, advertising, communicating and looking at new ways to improve my business so I am constantly on the net. It's quite easy to forget not everyone uses the net and probable only 15% of mfc fans use shrimpsvoices.

My point was simple Mike has waited to long IMO before commenting, I am sure that this could of been resolved much earlier!! I did not know that a fans club even existed!! :o
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby stoyles » Fri Jan 14, 2011 8:54 pm

This new drive to get an active group of supporters together for the benefit of the club and attempting to improve the morale of fans has always had an open invite to all, present, past and future.
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Bare Ben » Fri Jan 14, 2011 9:07 pm

Mike W. wrote:Sadly, after some years, a dispute arose concerning the management, by the Football Club, of the bar at Christie Park.


What better reason to start a new one?
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Re: Shrimps Supporters – a few FACTS and a situation report

Postby Sammy h » Sat Jan 15, 2011 12:45 am

Ockers, my post was not meant to come across as disrespectful, I apologise if you saw it this way. I don't think my age has anything to do with it. I just think if Mike had been in touch before hand we wouldn't be in this position.

I apologise if my post did look that way.
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