Trotters' Porkies Update

[thedoc]

https://shrimplythebestfootball.com/2022/11/11/

[Keith]

"Det Insp Knowles said in August that the investigation had been "hampered to an extent with the availability of getting key statements".

I wonder who it was who refused to give a police statement? Hmm... Perhaps if the people who refused to give the statement to the police, were the same people who made the allegation, they should be charged with wasting police time? Perhaps 'Santa' should sue for slander?

[CityShrimp]

Bolton fans will say that the ‘investigation being dropped’ proves nothing, but…

Why won’t Bolton comment? Perhaps they just don’t want to get into legal trouble but if your player had genuinely been racially abused, you wouldn’t just be content and have nothing to say about the investigation being dropped.

As Keith says, who are the people who couldn’t be bothered to make their statements afterwards? If it was Evatt and co then that is highly suspect. If your player was racially abused, why would you wait months and have to be chased up by the police before taking the necessary action to follow it up?

And… if the incident actually happened, I don’t believe it would be that hard to prove it. The accused person would have had a number of other Morecambe fans sat within basically a couple of metres - presumably none of them heard the remark (strange). Or is Evatt saying that numerous morecambe fans must have heard it but were all happy to brush it under the carpet?

It feels that in most cases, allegations of racism at football matches usually result in an outcome - culprits are caught and then punished/banned, regularly. Proving that an incident happened at a football match clearly isn’t usually super difficult.

Then take into account the fact that it was in Evatts interests to get the match abandoned/stopped and the fact that he is generally known to be an unpleasant guy… well, you can draw your own conclusion.

[Keith]

Then take into account the fact that it was in Evatt's interests to get the match abandoned/stopped...

Losing 1-0, down to ten men and knackered, they were able to warm up, dry out and revive themselves, while Robinson appeared to have lost his head entirely. If Evatt and/or the player who made the accusation are indeed the ones who then refused to cooperate with the police, then the FA should investigate.

[Keith]

As was written back in February...

The more I read and watch, I just feel we have been shithoused by Ian Evatt.

I think, because last night, I was concentrating on the allegation of racial abuse and the very real assaults by the thugs who follow Bolton, I'd not really thought about it, but if Evatt is telling the truth, then there will be clear, visible evidence of spitting. If this was indeed brought to the attention of the fourth official and stewards, then it is utterly disgusting, and I'm inclined to believe him about the racism too.

On the other hand, if there was no evidence of spitting shown to officials, then he's obviously lying, which calls in to question the rest of his allegations. I am confident that the Morecambe fans in the vicinity would have come forward if they had heard someone being racially abusive. Indeed, they may have done so. But if the only person to have heard this was Evatt himself, AND no evidence of spitting as he claims, then he, himself, needs to be investigated.

Looks like Berlin Waller called it right. No evidence of spitting or racism. I'd love to see the fourth officials comments, he was stood right there.

[Catte]

"Det Insp Knowles said in August that the investigation had been "hampered to an extent with the availability of getting key statements".

I wonder who it was who refused to give a police statement? Hmm... Perhaps if the people who refused to give the statement to the police, were the same people who made the allegation, they should be charged with wasting police time? Perhaps 'Santa' should sue for slander?

Clutching, nothing to say it was the club blocking this, I mentioned the Police statement is poorly worded and unfortunate that it clears nothing up for either party.

[Catte]

Bolton fans will say that the ‘investigation being dropped’ proves nothing, but…

Why won’t Bolton comment? Perhaps they just don’t want to get into legal trouble but if your player had genuinely been racially abused, you wouldn’t just be content and have nothing to say about the investigation being dropped.

As Keith says, who are the people who couldn’t be bothered to make their statements afterwards? If it was Evatt and co then that is highly suspect. If your player was racially abused, why would you wait months and have to be chased up by the police before taking the necessary action to follow it up?

And… if the incident actually happened, I don’t believe it would be that hard to prove it. The accused person would have had a number of other Morecambe fans sat within basically a couple of metres - presumably none of them heard the remark (strange). Or is Evatt saying that numerous morecambe fans must have heard it but were all happy to brush it under the carpet?

It feels that in most cases, allegations of racism at football matches usually result in an outcome - culprits are caught and then punished/banned, regularly. Proving that an incident happened at a football match clearly isn’t usually super difficult.

Then take into account the fact that it was in Evatts interests to get the match abandoned/stopped and the fact that he is generally known to be an unpleasant guy… well, you can draw your own conclusion.

Wow this is a real reach, neither you or I know what the investigation revealed, how much effort the police put in for something that would only ever be he said she said unless an independent witness stood up and said actually, he said this, or what he said has been misinterpreted. because the police statement is so wooly, we will never know. I assume as I do not know the gentleman that the case is somebody took offence either mishearing a comment or misunderstanding the comment. In the heat of a Football match often things said can be misheard and having hearing problems myself this happens unless I can read the lips.

Whilst I think the man is a good Manager, not a class act I doubt he would have been able to predict the outcome.

I dearly hope that the Gentleman involved is not too badly damaged or impacted.

[Catte]

Then take into account the fact that it was in Evatt's interests to get the match abandoned/stopped...

Losing 1-0, down to ten men and knackered, they were able to warm up, dry out and revive themselves, while Robinson appeared to have lost his head entirely. If Evatt and/or the player who made the accusation are indeed the ones who then refused to cooperate with the police, then the FA should investigate.

Wow Keith you think anybody can stop Evatt talking I wish I could. This was never going to go anywhere because there was never going to be proof one way or the other. But I am looking forwards to the day when he stops talking.

[Wild Bill]

I think the Bolton argument that its their word against ours is pretty weak one.

Lets assume that the Bolton bench spoke as one to say they heard a racist comment. This wouldn't be difficult to coordinate after the manager took them into the dressing room for ten mins.

Then the police interviewed a number of Morecambe fans, players and officials around the dugout as well as the fourth official. None of them say anything that supports the Bolton bench's claim, so the case is dropped.

Sure, some Morecambe fans could have pretended they didn't hear anything, but to say everyone did to protect the club is pretty unlikely. The fourth official would have nothing to gain from this also and would have been very close.

Personally I would speak out even against our own fans and would expect the majority of our fans would do the same if interviewed by police.

[Catte]

I think the Bolton argument that its their word against ours is pretty weak one.

Lets assume that the Bolton bench spoke as one to say they heard a racist comment. This wouldn't be difficult to coordinate after the manager took them into the dressing room for ten mins.

Then the police interviewed a number of Morecambe fans, players and officials around the dugout as well as the fourth official. None of them say anything that supports the Bolton bench's claim, so the case is dropped.

Sure, some Morecambe fans could have pretended they didn't hear anything, but to say everyone did to protect the club is pretty unlikely. The fourth official would have nothing to gain from this also and would have been very close.

Personally I would speak out even against our own fans and would expect the majority of our fans would do the same if interviewed by police.

Look, the CPS would not dare to go into a Court of law without evidence that proved one way or the other and given their track record they would not entertain one where the only evidence for and against the claims come from interested parties. Just will not happen.

I suspect the player involved misheard a comment, was an intense and loud atmosphere. I would hope all would call out racism which is why I suspect the gentleman said one thing in and the player heard something else, clearly something agitated him at that moment which is why I have to believe it was a mishear else someone in the area would have come forwards. The majority of us have been in a loud environment and seen if not been involved where something has been said and another individual has grasped the wrong end of the stick, happens to me all the time if I am out without my aid.

The said players reaction was explained to the Manager by the player who went off like rocket at what he was told by said player all hell kicks off and then the Police find nothing is no surprise to me, the only persons who know what was said will be in that stand and of course the gentleman who said it, and I have seen that he has stated that what he said was not racist and pleased to hear that. CPS would never go ahead with such a risky prosecution and or there was nothing to answer. I would suggest for the gentleman the best statement from the Police would have been on consultation with the CPS there is no evidence that he has a case to answer. Would have been the end of the story.

The 4th official may have heard something would he have been able to swear on the bible what he heard I doubt it. I would suggest we have to accept that what was said was not racist, definitely less than complementary, but also we have to accept that the player believed at that time he had been verbally abused hence is reaction, having watched him before and since he appears quite a calm individual unlike our Ian.

[thedoc]

Seems quite a tangled web to me that `Catte’ has spun on here to lean over backwards to try and justify the unjustifiable.

If a man like Evatt tells you as a substitute that you’ve heard a racist comment – even if you’re completely deaf – are you going to argue with him if he has the power to drop you from the squad altogether next time out – or even put you on the transfer list if you don’t go along with him?

Of course not – who would? This is how bullies of all sorts operate: “Do what I say – or else!”

Evatt lied about what happened last season at his place and accused our Derek of pushing one of his players when video evidence shows that he actually manhandled our manager and the King didn’t touch anybody at all.

One day, this default position to cheat and invent what might be politely called `variations on the truth’ will catch this gentleman out. Let’s hope it’s not too long before it happens.

[Old Man Kensey]

Seems quite a tangled web to me that `Catte’ has spun on here to lean over backwards to try and justify the unjustifiable.

If a man like Evatt tells you as a substitute that you’ve heard a racist comment – even if you’re completely deaf – are you going to argue with him if he has the power to drop you from the squad altogether next time out – or even put you on the transfer list if you don’t go along with him?

Of course not – who would? This is how bullies of all sorts operate: “Do what I say – or else!”

Evatt lied about what happened last season at his place and accused our Derek of pushing one of his players when video evidence shows that he actually manhandled our manager and the King didn’t touch anybody at all.

One day, this default position to cheat and invent what might be politely called `variations on the truth’ will catch this gentleman out. Let’s hope it’s not too long before it happens.

I agree with all of this, apart from the gentleman bit.

[Catte]

Blimey, Doc that was an even bigger stretch.

Watch the video the player reacts first, when the Manager gets involved it escalates very rapidly.

Not trying to defend IE at all, just suggesting the Morecambe fan may have been misheard and not a racist comment made at all.

I am not an IE fan and 90% of the time wish he would keep his thoughts just that, I get that you do not like him at all and I understand why but he cannot possibly be the master villain that you make him out to be I know he is not that intelligent.

By the way the word "Trotters" has nothing to do with Pork so the Subject misses the mark if you understand the origin of the nickname.

[thedoc]

Catte says ` bigger stretch'.

If I hadn't watched the video, I wouldn't have concluded that Evatt lied about it. Derek didn't touch anybody and the Bolton Manager laid his hands on him and shoved him out of the way. What's a `stretch' about that? - you can see what happened with your own eyes. Also, who cares about the etymology of the word `Trotters'? I don't, for a start. Trotters Porkies - Pigs' Update is the title I actually wanted to use for this article but I thought it too flippant for what is a serious matter for some of the people affected by what happened at the Maz when Bolton visited last. To get to the point - we all know what Evatt is. It doesn't matter whether or not he actually plans the lies he tells - the fact that he does so at all is an indictment of him as a manager and a human being. Lies have far-reaching consequences that even the smartest cookies can't necessarily predict. Santa was arrested and his family subjected to abuse and upset for months afterwards on the basis of what Evatt said happened at the time. It wasn't true then; it demonstrably isn't true now. If Derek Adams did something like this, I would want him out of our club. But Derek doesn't behave like that - few people, thankfully for the rest of us - actually do. Whether you're a Bolton fan or not - you can't condone what Evatt has done in this case.

[Catte]

I do not think I have tried to condone what Evatt did or does, I am not a fan of him and his BS and I call him out on it all the time.

What I said was the player reacted to something, then Evatt gets involved and it is pandemonium after that I doubt he had a master plan but he went ballistic.

I suggested it may have been a mishear on behalf of the player which he reacts to and ramps up when the player says what he thought he heard.
This you can see in some videos.

Look he represents my club for now, which in 130 years of the club to put up with the BS for a few years is nothing, he will go to something probably bigger than this and we will take the compensation and move on.

You can have your conspiracy theories all you like, and I hope the chap embroiled in this pantomime is still enjoying his footy and has not been tarred with this.

[marky No.1]

https://www.bwfc.co.uk/news/2023/januar ... behaviour/