Take your p45 Sammy and just go

[marky No.1]

It's too late now...but what a mistake by Sammy to allow Artell to leave, and I was also a fan of Wayne,who didn't score enough that's true, but could make goals for others.How we miss that as well.

"You never miss them till they are gone"

On the moan-ometer I think the percentages on Dave last season for being "too slow" having "hexagonal boots" and playing "hoof ball" are similar to the "lack of leadership" and "lack of goals from corners and free kicks" that we have now.

Wayne was a hero here for playing at centre forward but in his twilight years here he was filling in on the wing so was never going to make an impact I.M.O. although being Wayne he would always give his 110% for Morecambe F.C.

Twissy was also a hero but fizzled away towards the end even tho we were egging him on to show us his past brilliance.

I just hope that more players who have come here because they were good in certain positions are'nt going the same way

I worry for the day when Baz is wearing his armband in the centre back position

Anyway let's look forward, there ain't no point looking back cos they've gone now.

[Blackpool Shrimp]

I think the constant slagging off of the team and management is totally out of order and is not going to help...we probably havent got the results so far that everyone wants but I am sure the management and players are trying there hardest to put things right....and as for the artell situation when he was with us he got constant stick for not been good enough,some people have short memories...i was a big arts fan but I personal think we have got better players now even though they might be injured for a few weeks......Looking back at the Barnet game it was a below par performance for certain reasons but to come back from two down and almost win the game shows some fighting spirit - we would have lost that game a few seasons back...-there are lots of teams struggling at moment in there respective leagues for example bradford,southampton,everton and liverpool just to name a few but there is a long long way to go.....Just a message to the so called supporters who want sammy out who would they bring in to do a better job to be honest I bet they havent got a bloody clue so please lay off the poor guy

[marky No.1]

they havent got a bloody clue so please lay off

Quote of the year John. You will notice I have omitted the "poor guy" bit

[Seasider9601]

The trouble is shrimps1970, expectations at this club are now simply way too high from the fans. Year on year Sammy has improved upon our previous league position, and now, subsequently, we want, nay EXPECT, him to improve upon that. And that is UNREALISTIC.

It's not always going to happen like that. We've had brilliant progress over this past 4 league seasons. It took us from 1968 to 1995 to get out of the Northern Premier League. It then took us until 2007 to get out of the Conference. Finishing 4th last season was an unbelievable achievement by Sammy and Mark and now, expectations are through the roof. Even 4-4-2 Magazine predicted us to finish 3rd. How many times though do losing Play Off Semi Finalists struggle the following season? Countless.

We have come so far in such a short space of time the minute things start to go wrong, people get restless and demand change. We have got the strongest squad I'm sure (or so it appears...) and in Sammy and Mark we trust. We will turn that corner.

We need encouragement and support to get through this temporary dodgy patch !

SAMMY AND MARK WILL TURN THIS AROUND ! SO GET BEHIND THEM ! ! !

[Heysham_red]

The trouble is shrimps1970, expectations at this club are now simply way too high from the fans. Year on year Sammy has improved upon our previous league position, and now, subsequently, we want, nay EXPECT, him to improve upon that. And that is UNREALISTIC.

It's not always going to happen like that. We've had brilliant progress over this past 4 league seasons. It took us from 1968 to 1995 to get out of the Northern Premier League. It then took us until 2007 to get out of the Conference. Finishing 4th last season was an unbelievable achievement by Sammy and Mark and now, expectations are through the roof. Even 4-4-2 Magazine predicted us to finish 3rd. How many times though do losing Play Off Semi Finalists struggle the following season? Countless.

We have come so far in such a short space of time the minute things start to go wrong, people get restless and demand change. We have got the strongest squad I'm sure (or so it appears...) and in Sammy and Mark we trust. We will turn that corner.

We need encouragement and support to get through this temporary dodgy patch !

SAMMY AND MARK WILL TURN THIS AROUND ! SO GET BEHIND THEM ! ! !

What he said.

Of course we are all frustrated with the start of the season, I have no doubt that Sammy isnt too happy with it either. And of course when we are frustrated we don't get behind the team in the same way. The fact remains League survival has to be are first priority year on year anything else is a bonus (play off last year for example).

At present we just don't have the resources to compete with some of the bigger clubs in this league. That is the reality, we were pushing above our weight last season. I think we need a few years of stability in this league, increase revenue, increase support and really push on when we are well established. Of course its not a problem to dream about going up. and its been a disappointing start but we have to trust that the manager is doing the right thing. Otherwise we will implode and we will start getting on each others back (fans, playing staff and management) and it wont be pretty.

Sammy deserves time. And when he has been given it in the past, he has come good.

[shrimper]

But (and this is more about the start of the thread than your post, Marky) surely his record with us deserves a little more respect than calling for his head right now.

Respect? Just remind me again how much respect the club showed towards Jim Harvey following his heart attack? Like it or not this BUSINESS is driven by results on the pitch. The huge amounts of investment the board have made now mean results matter more than ever. Gone of the days of being a nice little family club. The death of which came with the removal of the Family Ticket this season, now that leaves a sour taste in the mouth. It also demonstrates the lack of respect being shown to your average match day punter, like I said it's big business now.

So like it or not a few awful performance like that might have the members of the board worrying a little more about their investments. Your die hards, like myself, will come every week however those that turn up looking for a day out of entertainment may not.

You slightly miss my point. I know it's a results business which is why I said that Sammy's previous record deserved the respect of not calling for his head now - he's had spells like this before and has always turned it round.
Respect for the club, respect for individuals - that's up to you. But I just think a record which is a matter of fact deserves some consideration when we're looking at our situation as it stands now.

[P/T Indie]

I can't but help get the feeling of deja vue back to the later years of JH's time.

Every season he kept making the same mistakes but then we still always ended up having a decent enough season getting around the playoffs then next year when you hope we will push on JH made the same mistakes again etc

The same is starting to happen with SM and the mistakes he makes what with these poor starts to the season and he never seems to learn from them. Yes he might turn it around and yes we might finish pushing for the playoffs but then next year the same will happen and the year after etc.

So in the end it comes down to the directors are they happy us having incosistent seasons but with midtable/top half finishes or does there come a time when they feel they have invested heavily and are no longer getting a return for there money and feel we must be pushing on.

The pressure for Sammy is that if the Globe starts to produce the income we hope and his player budget increases the directors will be wanting to see a return. It will be no good having a bigger player budget just to keep having the same old bad start and inconsistent season year after year.

[halftimeresults]

The trouble is shrimps1970, expectations at this club are now simply way too high from the fans. Year on year Sammy has improved upon our previous league position, and now, subsequently, we want, nay EXPECT, him to improve upon that. And that is UNREALISTIC.

It's not always going to happen like that. We've had brilliant progress over this past 4 league seasons. It took us from 1968 to 1995 to get out of the Northern Premier League. It then took us until 2007 to get out of the Conference. Finishing 4th last season was an unbelievable achievement by Sammy and Mark and now, expectations are through the roof. Even 4-4-2 Magazine predicted us to finish 3rd. How many times though do losing Play Off Semi Finalists struggle the following season? Countless.

We have come so far in such a short space of time the minute things start to go wrong, people get restless and demand change. We have got the strongest squad I'm sure (or so it appears...) and in Sammy and Mark we trust. We will turn that corner.

We need encouragement and support to get through this temporary dodgy patch !

SAMMY AND MARK WILL TURN THIS AROUND ! SO GET BEHIND THEM ! ! !

You talk about fans expectations being to high but it was Sammy that came out in public as saying this is the best ever squad he has had.

[Ntini]

I agree that expectations were somewhat unrealistic this season.

I agree that, like JH did in the conference, Sammy now appears to be making similar errors year on year.

I agree that it is disappointing to see us lingering around the foot of the table, with performances to suit.

And I also realistically agree that we will be ok (i.e. not relegated) and will still be able to make a decent go of the season, probably finishing mid table - just PLEASE don't use the phrase 'turning the corner' (it makes me cringe just typing that!)

So, should Sammy go?

Personally I think it's ridiculous, and that despite not playing well, everyone knows we have a good chance of a decent finish this year if we turn things round. I think it's far too early into a season to judge a manager.

However, the question is down to the board and how they feel. Do they need progression and a playoff finish as a suitable return on investment, especially with the new stadium? Do they feel there is someone else that could do a better job? Or do they agree with me that it's just ridiculous. That decision isn't for me to make, so inevitably it matters not what I think.

In my honest opinion, I don't think progression at this point in time would be good for the club. I think we would struggle in the league above and could risk the long-term financial security of the club. Therefore I'll be happy so long as at the end of the season we're not fighting relegation. Anything more is a bonus, and deep down we all know that!

[Bare Ben]

I agree that expectations were somewhat unrealistic this season.

I agree that, like JH did in the conference, Sammy now appears to be making similar errors year on year.

I agree that it is disappointing to see us lingering around the foot of the table, with performances to suit.

And I also realistically agree that we will be ok (i.e. not relegated) and will still be able to make a decent go of the season, probably finishing mid table - just PLEASE don't use the phrase 'turning the corner' (it makes me cringe just typing that!)

So, should Sammy go?

Personally I think it's ridiculous, and that despite not playing well, everyone knows we have a good chance of a decent finish this year if we turn things round. I think it's far too early into a season to judge a manager.

However, the question is down to the board and how they feel. Do they need progression and a playoff finish as a suitable return on investment, especially with the new stadium? Do they feel there is someone else that could do a better job? Or do they agree with me that it's just ridiculous. That decision isn't for me to make, so inevitably it matters not what I think.

In my honest opinion, I don't think progression at this point in time would be good for the club. I think we would struggle in the league above and could risk the long-term financial security of the club. Therefore I'll be happy so long as at the end of the season we're not fighting relegation. Anything more is a bonus, and deep down we all know that!

Top post.

[Posh]

I agree, top post Ntini.

At this stage last season we had 8 pts and the season before 7. We're on 7 now so no reason Sammy can't turn it around as he's done before.

While everyone wants to see us progress i'm sure most if us would like to see us consolidate again this season if it meant growing on it future. I also believe there is little chance of relegation.

I get the sense though that the reasons behind some of the disgruntlement with Sammy stems from reasons other than our success or otherwise in the league table.

[keepthefaith]

the reasons behind some of the disgruntlement with Sammy stems from reasons other than our success or otherwise in the league table.

I agree. I think some people have never got past the Jim Harvey saga. Don't get me wrong, I liked the guy a lot, but after years of going consistently nowhere towards the end, the club had to make a decision to take Morecambe FC forward - and thats where that decision took us. Forward. We improve year on year, and for me that is ENOUGH (for now )
I, for one cannot believe the expectations some fans have from Morecambe. And I cannot believe the utter disrespect some show to Sammy.
I just want to say some of us are extremely grateful for the achievements Sammy and Mark have brought us so far, League football at the first full attempt, consistently better finishes each season, playoffs last year, some fantastic cup results. And to the board, for a fabulous new stadium, league football, a financially secure club (which a lot of clubs in this land would do anything for)
I seem to remember a thread like this, this time last season. Then, after a run of good results, it was all forgotten until someone dragged the thread back up - and I seem to remember quite a few red faces and apologies?!
So until Sammy, or the club let us down in any way, shape or form (which I doubt they will) - they deserve nothing but our full backing, and not the ungrateful, unjustified, throwing toys out of the pram that has been shown from a few recently, due to nothing but overly high expectations.

[Seasider9601]

Well said keepthefaith. For a first post, brilliant.

The thing that worries me is that with all this negativity and disrespect shown to Sammy, it might not take much for him to say "b*ll*cks to it". And just resign. I sincerely hope not.

And we do NOT want that to happen, even on our current form shown in the league.

Sammy and Mark WILL turn this around !! Starting tonight.

[Heysham_Shrimp]

the reasons behind some of the disgruntlement with Sammy stems from reasons other than our success or otherwise in the league table.

I agree. I think some people have never got past the Jim Harvey saga. Don't get me wrong, I liked the guy a lot, but after years of going consistently nowhere towards the end, the club had to make a decision to take Morecambe FC forward - and thats where that decision took us. Forward. We improve year on year, and for me that is ENOUGH (for now )
I, for one cannot believe the expectations some fans have from Morecambe. And I cannot believe the utter disrespect some show to Sammy.
I just want to say some of us are extremely grateful for the achievements Sammy and Mark have brought us so far, League football at the first full attempt, consistently better finishes each season, playoffs last year, some fantastic cup results. And to the board, for a fabulous new stadium, league football, a financially secure club (which a lot of clubs in this land would do anything for)
I seem to remember a thread like this, this time last season. Then, after a run of good results, it was all forgotten until someone dragged the thread back up - and I seem to remember quite a few red faces and apologies?!
So until Sammy, or the club let us down in any way, shape or form (which I doubt they will) - they deserve nothing but our full backing, and not the ungrateful, unjustified, throwing toys out of the pram that has been shown from a few recently, due to nothing but overly high expectations.

good post. with the exception of the FA Trophy win over Dartford my best moments watching Morecambe have been under Sammy and Mark's stewardship of the team.
Beating Exeter City at Wembley
winning at Deepdale
winning at Molineaux
beating Coventry City
coming back from 2-0 down with ten men and beating Peterborough
coming back from 3-1 down and 3 minutes to go also with ten men and beating Crewe

[Seasider9601]

the reasons behind some of the disgruntlement with Sammy stems from reasons other than our success or otherwise in the league table.

I agree. I think some people have never got past the Jim Harvey saga. Don't get me wrong, I liked the guy a lot, but after years of going consistently nowhere towards the end, the club had to make a decision to take Morecambe FC forward - and thats where that decision took us. Forward. We improve year on year, and for me that is ENOUGH (for now )
I, for one cannot believe the expectations some fans have from Morecambe. And I cannot believe the utter disrespect some show to Sammy.
I just want to say some of us are extremely grateful for the achievements Sammy and Mark have brought us so far, League football at the first full attempt, consistently better finishes each season, playoffs last year, some fantastic cup results. And to the board, for a fabulous new stadium, league football, a financially secure club (which a lot of clubs in this land would do anything for)
I seem to remember a thread like this, this time last season. Then, after a run of good results, it was all forgotten until someone dragged the thread back up - and I seem to remember quite a few red faces and apologies?!
So until Sammy, or the club let us down in any way, shape or form (which I doubt they will) - they deserve nothing but our full backing, and not the ungrateful, unjustified, throwing toys out of the pram that has been shown from a few recently, due to nothing but overly high expectations.

good post. with the exception of the FA Trophy win over Dartford my best moments watching Morecambe have been under Sammy and Mark's stewardship of the team.
Beating Exeter City at Wembley
winning at Deepdale
winning at Molineaux
beating Coventry City
coming back from 2-0 down with ten men and beating Peterborough
coming back from 3-1 down and 3 minutes to go also with ten men and beating Crewe

But at the time, I bet you also listed drawing with Buxton to gain promotion, beating Cambridge in the FA Cup, beating Chesterfield in the FA Cup away from home, playing Ipswich twice etc etc etc !!!

[P/T Indie]

I agree. I think some people have never got past the Jim Harvey saga. Don't get me wrong, I liked the guy a lot, but after years of going consistently nowhere towards the end, the club had to make a decision to take Morecambe FC forward


But aren't we back in the same situation?

Same mistakes year on year, strange team selections, bad starts every year, cant work out the best system every year.

Like I said before it's down to the directors as only them know how much or little money Sammy has been given and if they feel they are getting a return or not. Is the plan to consolidate for a couple of years then great there is no problem but if they feel they have increased the budget then that brings increased expectations on Sammy.

[Blackpool Shrimp]

sammy and mark have been in football long enough to know what is expected of them,dont think they need telling by any of us.....if we can get a win tonight we could push nearly up to mid table so lets all keep the faith and get behind the team and management.....if any team lost both there centre halfs in a match like we did on saturday they would struggle doesnt matter who is

[keepthefaith]

THIS IS WHAT ANNOYS ME.
How are we anywhere near in the same situation?! We are playing LEAGUE FOOTBALL for a start and finishing higher and higher each year. Yes we might start slowly, but last time I checked the season was 40+ games long and wasn't won in the first 2-3 months.
I can't believe we start so badly, and still manage for the team to gel, go on a run of results, and STILL manage to finish 4th. Its a disgrace. Sack Sammy I say
If we were mid table obscurity, or struggling to stay up each year, then yes I'd agree. But we aren't. And until that happens, we need to give Sammy, Mark, and the lads a break.

[Heysham_Shrimp]

I agree. I think some people have never got past the Jim Harvey saga. Don't get me wrong, I liked the guy a lot, but after years of going consistently nowhere towards the end, the club had to make a decision to take Morecambe FC forward - and thats where that decision took us. Forward. We improve year on year, and for me that is ENOUGH (for now )
I, for one cannot believe the expectations some fans have from Morecambe. And I cannot believe the utter disrespect some show to Sammy.
I just want to say some of us are extremely grateful for the achievements Sammy and Mark have brought us so far, League football at the first full attempt, consistently better finishes each season, playoffs last year, some fantastic cup results. And to the board, for a fabulous new stadium, league football, a financially secure club (which a lot of clubs in this land would do anything for)
I seem to remember a thread like this, this time last season. Then, after a run of good results, it was all forgotten until someone dragged the thread back up - and I seem to remember quite a few red faces and apologies?!
So until Sammy, or the club let us down in any way, shape or form (which I doubt they will) - they deserve nothing but our full backing, and not the ungrateful, unjustified, throwing toys out of the pram that has been shown from a few recently, due to nothing but overly high expectations.[/quote]

good post. with the exception of the FA Trophy win over Dartford my best moments watching Morecambe have been under Sammy and Mark's stewardship of the team.
Beating Exeter City at Wembley
winning at Deepdale
winning at Molineaux
beating Coventry City
coming back from 2-0 down with ten men and beating Peterborough
coming back from 3-1 down and 3 minutes to go also with ten men and beating Crewe[/quote]

But at the time, I bet you also listed drawing with Buxton to gain promotion, beating Cambridge in the FA Cup, beating Chesterfield in the FA Cup away from home, playing Ipswich twice etc etc etc !!![/quote]

agreed, at the time those were obviously landmark results because we had just endured about 20 years of dross under a succession of poor managers.
Someone pointed out that Sammy had benefitted by inheriting Jim Harvey's team. Well Jim Harvey benefitted by inheriting Bryan Griffith's team with the famous 5 etc.
Jim Harvey was a good manager for Morecambe but Sammy has taken us up to a new level of expectation.

[Seasider9601]

And that level of expectation is now at ridiculously high levels in some quarters due to our wonderful past 5 seasons, finishing year on year in a higher position than the last.

And it's a level of expectation which is unfair and unrealistic. Let's just appreciate what we HAVE got in Sammy and Mark and what they have brought to our club and done for us. So far.

Another chapter could well be written in the success story of Sammy and Mark. In due course.

[Heysham_Shrimp]

And that level of expectation is now at ridiculously high levels in some quarters due to our wonderful past 5 seasons, finishing year on year in a higher position than the last.

And it's a level of expectation which is unfair and unrealistic. Let's just appreciate what we HAVE got in Sammy and Mark and what they have brought to our club and done for us. So far.

Another chapter could well be written in the success story of Sammy and Mark. In due course.

AGREED.
The problem is so many of our fans have only known the good times. They don't remember the bad old days , losing away to Maine Road FC, The Bangor City fiasco, having to go to Maine Road for a home FA Cup replay against York City because Christie Park was so unsuitable etc etc

[Seasider9601]

Exactly Heysham !

Going to Maine Road Manchester to play York because Christie was deemed unsuitable. The SAME Christie Park which has since had 5000+ crowds in many a time in recent years ! And then, only 1305 turned up AT Maine Road !!

Our younger fans don't also remember struggles against relegation, re-election even. Points deducted (in 1988/89 season) for fielding ineligible players. FA Cup 1st Qualifying Round exits, followed the WEEK AFTER by FA Trophy 1st Qualifying Round exits. And that's QUALIFYING ROUNDS, not First Round PROPERS. Struggling to attract gates of 300 or more. The one armed bandit machine in the World Cup 82 Club having to be raided and emptied, just to pay the players wages !!!

Now. Remind me. How far have we come ???

[Christies Child]

Exactly Heysham !

Going to Maine Road Manchester to play York because Christie was deemed unsuitable. The SAME Christie Park which has since had 5000+ crowds in many a time in recent years ! And then, only 1305 turned up AT Maine Road !!

Our younger fans don't also remember struggles against relegation, re-election even. Points deducted (in 1988/89 season) for fielding ineligible players. FA Cup 1st Qualifying Round exits, followed the WEEK AFTER by FA Trophy 1st Qualifying Round exits. And that's QUALIFYING ROUNDS, not First Round PROPERS. Struggling to attract gates of 300 or more. The one armed bandit machine in the World Cup 82 Club having to be raided and emptied, just to pay the players wages !!!

Now. Remind me. How far have we come ???

Totally agree with what you have posted BUT this seasons expectations have been in part due to Sammy's claim that we have the strongest squad ever since his time at MFC. Not many would disagree with that expression of optomism in fact he needs to be applauded for putting together a squad of undoubted talent.

However the results to date have not in fairness lived up to expectations. As to why, then that is open to debate. Is it tactics? Is it bad luck? Whatever the reason is, then a small minority will be calling for drastic action, which in my opinion is far too early. If results remain the same come December then maybe then will possibly be the time for action. Something that I'm sure the Board will take a lot of thought before doing so.

Now is not the time for knee jerk reactions.