1920 Union

[Billy bodger]

I don’t think the 1920 Union is a joke, it’s concerned fans wanting to save the Club and there is nothing wrong in that.
What I would say is it has come up with some ideas, there is no doubt that these ideas are keeping Morecambe FC’s plight in the limelight. However, I don’t think I’m being harsh, if I said it has not yet come up with something that absolutely nails Jason.
I wish them luck in their campaign, even if I think some of the ideas in the end may harm the Club more than Jason, but they are trying.
I am to trying! Trying to come up with something that nails Jason in the eyes of the EFL, that may be impossible as they don’t seem to see how many Clubs are being let down by their owners, they just don’t want to know.

[Hodgie1978]

What I would say is to anyone criticising 1920 Union is that they set up to be a protest group against Jason. In that time they've listened to the club regarding doing something drastic like a pitch invasion or chucking tennis balls onto the pitch. Infact they've do everything they can in improving the spirit at our club. Making donations for the Trust flag appeal, foodbank appeals and they even sent the team a goodie hamper .
I'm guessing that the boycott is the final straw.

[Andy D]

i feel administration is the only way to get rid of Jason.

With a fair few interested with buying MFC at a realistic price set by the Administrator's, possibly in a auction.

[Hodgie1978]

What is the biggest debt the club has other than to Jason?
Somebody would have to call it in and we wouldn't be able to pay it .

[Phoenix Shrimp 2017]

Didn't our Directors publicly state a few months ago that going into administration would be a disaster for the club?

I don't personally know enough about the administration process but it does seem to be the 'nuclear option'. Before we go down the road of not a penny more etc' it would be interesting to know the current opinions of the Board and or Trust on this. I would imagine they haven't changed.

Personally I am currently in favour of supporting the club as normal, relegation or not. Supporters are there to support!

[Billy bodger]

What I would say is to anyone criticising 1920 Union is that they set up to be a protest group against Jason. In that time they've listened to the club regarding doing something drastic like a pitch invasion or chucking tennis balls onto the pitch. Infact they've do everything they can in improving the spirit at our club. Making donations for the Trust flag appeal, foodbank appeals and they even sent the team a goodie hamper .
I'm guessing that the boycott is the final straw.

I expect because you were the first who posted after my post on the 1920 Union and what as a group they are doing, that you include me as a person who criticise the 1920 Union.
I admit I have in the past, but my position has changed, I’m OK with any protest that helps keep the plight of Morecambe FC in the limelight and anything that puts pressure on Jason as long as it’s lawful.
I want Jason gone, every Morecambe fan wants that and to be successful in that my point is in my last post was Jason has not be swayed by any of the things the 1920 Union has done. The not a penny more campaign is a plan, that will be very painful, to bring about administration and I’m OK if that’s what you want, truly, we both want the same thing.
My approach is to nail him somehow in the eyes of the EFL (or the law!),where they step in. It is allowed for those that poo poo that idea, it’s finding it. Jason besides being a lot of things is someone who rides a line and I’m trying my best to find out if he stepped over it. Yes I have so far totally failed, again not being to harsh the 1920 Union has failed, but that will not stop me trying. If anything the ‘ Not a Penny More’ campaign will be successful before me, but that approach will severely harm the Club, where if I find that Jason somewhere slipped up, the Club will not suffer.

[Hodgie1978]

Billy it wasn't a dig at you mate. Honestly the difference between Shrimpsvoices and the Facebook fans pages in a million miles apart.
On here you can have an adult debate about it.

[Keith]

My approach is to nail him somehow in the eyes of the EFL (or the law!),where they step in. It is allowed for those that poo poo that idea, it’s finding it.

Not poo-pooing the idea, I simply don't understand it. Please expand. In a hypothetical situation, what action by a hypothetical dodgy owner, could result in the EFL 'stepping in'? What action could they actually take?

As far as I understand it [happy to be corrected], the 'biggest' sanction the EFL can deliver is to ban that entirely hypothetical dodgy owner, from being a Director of a hypothetical club, but they have no powers to remove their shareholding from them. In our situation, Whittingham isn't a Director anyway, so that wouldn't hurt him.

For the 'law' to step in and acquire a hypothetical dodgy owner's assets, they would need to be convicted of some pretty hefty offences, such as money laundering, major drug distribution etcetera. In our situation, Whittingham appears to be acting immorally, but legally.

The not a penny more campaign is a plan, that will be very painful, to bring about administration and I’m OK if that’s what you want, truly, we both want the same thing.

Despite the best efforts of the 1920 Union, or the Trust, or individual fans, the only power we actually have that can actually make a difference, is a 'not a penny more' campaign. And the Directors are correct, it would severely hurt the club, perhaps its very existence. The only way we should consider this route, is if the ongoing damage by Whittingham is also seen as existential. Personally, as I've said before, if we are relegated, then we may as well go down this route. We wouldn't ever get back in the Football League and if he continued to milk the club dry, we'd likely be relegated again. Even in National League North, he'd be wanting the interest on his loans. All we'd be doing is allowing him to take even more money out of the club, until it eventually went under anyway. Then he'd merrily go on his way, and never think of Morecambe again.

However, if we manage to avoid relegation, then we need to remain firmly behind the club and hope that one of Musk's 'Star Link' rockets lands on Whittingham's head, or he accepts a genuine offer. Unfortunately, at the moment, both outcomes are as likely as the other.

If the protest group can actually force him to a position where he thinks 'I don't need the hassle' and moves on, then great, but unfortunately, at the moment, I don't think he gives a crap, as long as he's getting the cash.

[lancaster shrimp]

What would you want our owner to be doing now?
He should be the one leading from the front giving the fans the confidence that if we go down we'll be alright.
We should be planning for next season regardless of what league we are in.
Jim Bentley was at least allowed to offer contracts to our better players. We don't do that anymore.
We are gonna be in the same situation again of signing players that nobody wants.
Jason's will again be asking for an unrealistic price for a club that is losing its value day by day.
We will always have fans that will turn up but I think this boycott if happens is gonna shock a few people.
The club might think the 1920 Union are a joke.
I don't think they'll be laughing if nothing changes

100% this. It seems like some people are just happy to let and watch our club die.

[redrobo]

I've made my position on this 'not a penny more' option perfectly clear...I think it is wrong as the only thing to suffer will be my and your club.

Jason doesn't give a sod about what the fans feel about him so the campaign will have little if any effect on him.

If fans decide to take up the campaign then I'm be at the head of those who will campaign for the direct opposite.

I haven't followed my club for over 67 years to see its demise due to the actions of a group who seem intent on ruining the club...maybe even see the end of the club.

I accept that others will have the opposite opinion.....but for me the 'not a penny more' action is a definate NO.....

[Hodgie1978]

The demise of the club is down to the 1920 Union.
Do you actually believe that Neil? Really?
Lost for words

[Andy D]

The demise of the club is down to the 1920 Union.
Do you actually believe that Neil? Really?
Lost for words

Neil is just Virtue Signalling, knowing at least one of the BoD read SVs

[Hodgie1978]

My lad has stopped having peas and gravy with his pie on match day. Have to be careful Neil's anti protest group doesn't see him as he'll be blamed for relegation.

[al1]

The 1920 Union seem to be the only ones with any ideas regarding trying to move on the sale of the club,at the January forum both the club and trust said they would provide regular updates on the situation.But I do not recall any official statement since then, which is now over 2 months!

[redrobo]

I understand the logic of the 'not a penny more' campaign but if fans withdraw their support for home games that means the club will be suffer financially which I doubt our current excellent BoDs can cover from their own resources.

The buck once again falls on the owner to provide funds that he will then charge an exorbitant rate of interest which the the club has to find from somewhere. With fans withdrawing their home support that means a reduction in gate money...etc etc etc.

Whatever we ALL think of the current owner he has provided funds ( albeit not at the level we all would wish for) to keep the club in business which for me is the most important outcome.

I respect all those who may /will back the campaign it's just that for me it's misguided and the only ones to suffer will be the club we all support.

[Keith]

I think it is wrong as the only thing to suffer will be my and your club.

Jason doesn't give a sod about what the fans feel about him so the campaign will have little if any effect on him.

I haven't followed my club for over 67 years to see its demise due to the actions of a group who seem intent on ruining the club...maybe even see the end of the club.

If we are relegated then we will still be paying almost a third of a million pounds in interest for the loans. Whittingham won't care, as long as he gets that cash.

We'll then be fighting a relegation battle in the National League. We may just about survive in the National League, but we'd be a favourite for another relegation. If that happened, then what?

We'd STILL have that level of interest repayments to award to Whittingham, but our income will be massively reduced. No Football League cash. No TV money. No large away following. Massively reduced crowds generally, and less income due to cheaper ticket prices. At this point, the club is unsustainable, no matter what, and we go under. But, Whittingham will have had a few more years of screwing the club and increasing his bank balance. No-one will be interested in buying the club, because the loans will be more than the value of the club. We're on life support, until the club is finally drained, and dies.

'Not a Penny More' next season, IF WE'RE RELEGATED OUT OF THE FOOTBALL LEAGUE, would definitely harm the club. Possibly, even put it out of business. If we go out of business and have to start again, we do so debt free and Whittingham free. Or, we may get bought for a realistic amount when in Administration. Or, it may be that Whittingham sees the writing on the wall, and moves the club on while it still has some value.

We have to hope we can survive in the League for another season. But if not, we can't just keep swelling his bank balance.

[Billy bodger]

Hi Keith and others.
Here is the wording from the EFL Hand Book > Rules & Governance FAQs:-
What is the Owners and Directors Test?

“The Owners and Directors Test requirement sets out criteria for who is and who is not permitted to own a Club or exercise control over it. The Test requirements can be viewed here. The Test forms part of any takeover process and is applied to all current Owners and all prospective Owners on an ongoing basis.”

So it clearly states for both Owners and Directors the Test is ‘on an ongoing basis’ As they have said it’s objective and it’s only applied to Directors on an ‘on going basis’ I can only equate it to a cosy gentleman’s agreement that does not tackle one of the primary causes of Clubs going bust and that’s bad Owners not being ACCOUNTABLE ‘on a ongoing basis’

There is no doubt when you go on and read all the rules and regs of the Owners and Directors Test that there is absolutely no appetite to apply it to Owners on an ongoing basis. When it comes to Directors they will act within the rules, hence Jason & Goldring relinquishing themselves from being Directors, while still being Owners. Goldring later stepped down from being an Owner.

All this means once you become an owner the EFL will not remove you, unlike the National League (part of their slightly different rules). The EFL aligned their rules with the Premiership for continuity,(promotion/relegation to and from the Premiership).

So as time moves on and the Premiership moves further away from the rest of the Football family is it maybe it’s time for the EFL to also align its self with the National League to protect Clubs from bad owners?

And all that is the problem.

[mrpotatohead]

For clarity on the clubs financial situation next season , there will be a parachute payment, about 53% of the money they would receive off the EFL for being a league 2 club ,which is more than most of the other clubs in the division will have, not ideal but its a plus.

[Andy D]

For clarity on the clubs financial situation next season , there will be a parachute payment, about 53% of the money they would receive off the EFL for being a league 2 club ,which is more than most of the other clubs in the division will have, not ideal but its a plus.

good to know, for potentially any new owner after administration and points deduction.

[Keith]

“The Owners and Directors Test requirement sets out criteria for who is and who is not permitted to own a Club or exercise control over it. The Test requirements can be viewed here. The Test forms part of any takeover process and is applied to all current Owners and all prospective Owners on an ongoing basis.”

But does it say what sanctions the EFL can impose to someone who already owns a club? Whittingham isn't a Director, so [arguably] not 'exercising control'?